Business Listings Deleted by Google - Do Not Support Location Update

Joined
Sep 5, 2012
Messages
293
I've seen a couple SAB's with a hidden address in the places dash and their address displays on MM :eek:

Any thoughts on that Andrew?

Why would that happen?
Well that would account for SABs being deleted. Its a major database issue as they're never suppose to show up in GMM. I'd suggest using the 'Report' command for the GMM feature to indicate wrong information for SABs you have access to the dashboard and are positive the address is hidden. I would leave a note to the effect of: 'This is a SAB. The address is hidden, as I have access to the Places dashboard. This feature should be fixed. Please don't delete as it will remove the Places page. '

There is no guarantee it won't be deleted but that's your best option; GRs alledgedly read comments in feature history. Also I would report the feature via the Places page in Maps.

Its a major issue that allows anyone to delete an SAB that's erroneously showing in GMM and comply with the rules. There is no way to know a feature has its address hidden.
 

Colan Nielsen

Administrator
LocalU Faculty
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Thanks for the advice. Would it possibly be better to just leave it alone in MM? I'm worried that drawing attention to it may cause an undesired action by a reviewer.

Do you think this issue with SAB addresses showing in MM had a lot to do with why businesses who were following the rules and had hidden their addresses in places dash and were deleted anyway?
 

Linda Buquet

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Jun 28, 2012
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13,313
While I have not done deep analysis on this, MOST hidden address listings I've checked including my own listing SHOW address in MM. I hid my address immediately as soon as the new guideline went into affect back in March or whenever. And my address has always showed up in MM.

I recently mentioned here in the forum? For those that previously hid address BY CHOICE (before it was a requirement) simply because they did not want customers to know where they lived, well so much for privacy...
 

Gio Greenard

Member
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Oct 1, 2012
Messages
51
Sorry to hear the news Jason, I'm sure your bounce right back!

I know this question has been asked before but I cant find the thread.

Am I right in thinking you don't need to hide the address if someone is there (a receptionist) to note any customer queries and there is a meeting room, where if needed a meeting could be held. I'm thinking a virtual office in this instance.

If your clients business is based from their home, but for the vast majority your client visits customers at their premises/homes (a synthetic grass installer for example) and your wife answers the phone whilst your out and can take payments. Do you still need to hide your address? as customers can visit your location if they wanted/needed to.

I realise the above scenarios are completely different to a stand alone high street business, I just find this to be a very grey area, apologies if I'm re asking an already answered question.

Gio
 

Colan Nielsen

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LocalU Faculty
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Messages
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Well that would account for SABs being deleted. Its a major database issue as they're never suppose to show up in GMM. I'd suggest using the 'Report' command for the GMM feature to indicate wrong information for SABs you have access to the dashboard and are positive the address is hidden. I would leave a note to the effect of: 'This is a SAB. The address is hidden, as I have access to the Places dashboard. This feature should be fixed. Please don't delete as it will remove the Places page. '

There is no guarantee it won't be deleted but that's your best option; GRs alledgedly read comments in feature history. Also I would report the feature via the Places page in Maps.

Its a major issue that allows anyone to delete an SAB that's erroneously showing in GMM and comply with the rules. There is no way to know a feature has its address hidden.
Well I have some good news and a concern wrapped up into one. A client who is an SAB that was taken down back in June is back, live, and ranking great!

My concern is that there is a pending edit on Map Maker that is trying to apparently have this listing deleted again :eek:

Is this because the address is still showing in Map Maker? If this is the case, this is insanity..:confused:

The following edit requires further approvals.<button ct="ln" cad="src:rvw-edit;type:moderate" class="kd-button" style="min-width: 54px; border: 1px solid rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.0980392); color: rgb(68, 68, 68); font-size: 11px; font-weight: bold; height: 27px; padding: 0px 8px; line-height: 27px; border-top-left-radius: 2px; border-top-right-radius: 2px; border-bottom-right-radius: 2px; border-bottom-left-radius: 2px; -webkit-transition: all 0.218s; background-color: rgb(245, 245, 245); background-image: -webkit-linear-gradient(top, rgb(245, 245, 245), rgb(241, 241, 241)); margin: 0px; box-sizing: content-box;">Review edit</button>

<tbody>
</tbody>

Pending


Deleted on Dec 2, 2012 7:16am
Place marked as removed


---------- Post Merged at 09:42 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:28 AM ----------

Link to Map Maker listing -

Google Map Maker
 

Linda Buquet

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Oh dear, I brought addresses showing up in MM as a concern to Google more pointing to the inconsistencies between products and if they should not be in sync and also pointing to privacy concerns. But someone (not from Google) kinda shot it down as irrelevant. (I think sort of implying MM is just a tool for mappers, consumers don't use it therefore does not matter if the address shows there or not.)

JUST occurred to me though since you brought this up - THIS could be why I got a moderation call 2 weeks after I hid my address. (My address STILL shows in MM even months after hiding.) THIS could be why TONS of businesses were deleted even though they complied and hid address.

I always assumed the moderators were calling/deleting based on a list that was maybe not totally updated. BUT now I realize they were probably using MM.

SO the fact that MM and Places Dashboard are not in sync re hidden addresses could very definitely be causing a problem.

HOWEVER since this is a locksmith, they could have been removed for a different reason like an over-aggressive mapper taking them down for spam as they sometimes do with locksmiths???

I'll try to bring this to Jade's attention when I get a chance. I just never thought it was right and could cause problems that MM was not syncing when dashboard hides the address.
 

Colan Nielsen

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HOWEVER since this is a locksmith, they could have been removed for a different reason like an over-aggressive mapper taking them down for spam as they sometimes do with locksmiths???
The original reason the listing was hacked (I believe) is because a UPS address was (unknowingly) being used. Once I figured this out, I had the client give me a proper address, hid it in the places dash and submitted a troubleshooter report.

But that does not explain why there is another "pending" edit in Map Maker as of yesterday that is trying to have it removed again.

Linda, I think you are correct in assuming that the moderators are calling based on what they see on Map Maker. IF that's the case, it would pretty much explain the whole fiasco.
 

Linda Buquet

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Colan and all. I escalated to Jade, will keep you posted if I learn anything I can share.

I told her - I am not asking how a business should fix this if discovered. I am saying MM needs to sync up so compliant, honest businesses that are playing by the rules don?t get nuked.
 

Linda Buquet

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Ya I saw the 2nd pending edit earlier when I checked it. Not sure.
Maybe Jade can see more on the backend and will have some insight.
 

Flash

1
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Jul 20, 2012
Messages
177
Sorry, November was crazy for me, so I'm coming late to the thread, but thought I'd add what I've seen.

At one time SABs did not show in MM unless searched. In other words, they existed just like they do in Maps; you wouldn't find it while scrolling around the map doing cleanup but would find it if you searched for a category or company name. Once in a blue moon there would be one that was messed up and showed in MM even though it was properly set up in Places.

SABs started to sometimes not send the fact that the address was hidden over to MM a few months back. The solution that Places support seems to have come up with was to go into the MM entry and blank the street address. This then makes them even more violation, typical of Places support who use MM but don't bother to learn the guidelines so they can keep Places users in compliance.

It does seem like they are all showing now. However, don't forget that while anyone can mark a POI for deletion, nothing happens unless trusted reviewers approve. Even with the RER program, most trusted reviews are done by Google Reviewers that have full visibility to the state of the item. Reviewers tend to be extra cautious about deletions; and so the approvals are only likely to happen once the reviewer is well satisfied about the non-compliance. I personally check any that I am deleting or reviewing in Places.

Will some get accidentally deleted? Of course, every process has mistakes happen. The mistakes in this case are almost all caused by Places/G+ issues such as:


  • Places isn't hiding the address on the Maps database anymore, causing this issue in the first place.
  • It has been months since Places switched to G+ Local and the "Verified/Claimed" marking has yet to reappear, making it hard to judge if a listing is in compliance.
  • Places Support just messes things up more via Map Maker misuse.


What you have to remember is that SABs are not allowed on the map; but Places decided to allow them into their system via a method that kept them off the map but appearing in searches. Places is then messing up and putting them on the map, so you cannot blame Map Maker users for deleting them. I'd estimate that almost all of the SABs that appear on the map and get deleted are either not claimed to begin with, and then of those that are claimed most are not in compliance. Those that are in compliance but mistakenly show on the map are a very small minority of the total, and reviewers should catch them but won't always. The map would fill up with useless information if all of those invalid listings weren't deleted; and so the process must continue. Places needs to get it's act in order if it wants to allow a method for SABs to list.

For those of you that spend a lot of time in the Places forum; think about the hundreds of SABs that have come in saying they were deleted. I have yet to see one where it turned out they were in compliance but a Map Maker user deleted them. Leaving out the few that just got in compliance and were deleted by the quality team using old lists; every one of them in the end admits that they never hid it or decided to unhide it.
 

Linda Buquet

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Oh darn Colan. Joy is going to be super bummed after as hard as I know you guys worked on this one!
 

Flash

1
Joined
Jul 20, 2012
Messages
177
No, that's a link to a search within Map Maker.

Have you edited it within Map Maker before? If so, we should be able to find the link in your MM profile.
 

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